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Ahira's Hangar • View topic - Orson Scott Card - Ender's Game and other great stories (res

Orson Scott Card - Ender's Game and other great stories (res

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Orson Scott Card - Ender's Game and other great stories (res

Postby Duchess of Malfi » Wed May 20, 2009 7:28 am

Rescued thread!

MsMary
Master Pilot


Joined: 29 Apr 2002
Posts: 777

Posted: 11 Jun 2002 18:14 Post subject: Orson Scott Card - Ender's Game and other great stories...

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Has anyone else here read Orson Scott Card? He is a wonderful writer of both novels and short stories. He is best known for his scifi stories, though in fact his stories are not easily pigeon-holed into one genre.

Ender’s Game is the best known book of Orson Scott Card, and the first one that I ever read. Ender’s Game is a quick moving science fiction story that draws you in and catches you in its plot. I couldn’t wait to find out what would happen next.

To summarize the plot (without giving away the ending), an alien race threatens the Earth. The last time they invaded they almost destroyed the Human race, but the government of Earth is determined not to let that happen again. A Battle School is set up, at which they are training the future commander of the army they hope will defeat the Buggers, as the aliens are called. Young but brilliant children are selected to go to Battle School, and they are trained using a combination of video games and war games in the “Battle Room.” Ender is the best at all the games, but you have to read the book to find out what happens. And it is definitely worth reading. The ending is not what you might expect.

There are 3 sequels to Ender’s Game, which are very different in tone from Ender’s Game itself. The first, Speaker for the Dead, is possibly the best book OSC has written, in my opinion. It’s more philosophical than EG. It’s followed by Xenocide and Children of the Mind. The parallel series, still in the making, includes Ender’s Shadow, Shadow of the Hegemon, and Shadow Puppets, due out this summer.

You can find out more about OSC by checking out his website, hatrack.com/. And it has a very nice forum, by the way, which Foamy and I are active members of. Skyweir has also participated, proving that you don't have to have read OSC to enjoy his website (which is really more of an online community). .

~MsMary~
"Does the walker choose the path, or the path the walker?"Edited by: MsMaryMalone at: 6/11/02 6:44:42 pm


danlo60
Master Pilot


Joined: 27 Mar 2002
Posts: 3468

Posted: 11 Jun 2002 18:21 Post subject: Re: Orson Scott Card - Ender's Game and other great stories.

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COOL!!! Thanks MMM!! I don't kno much about Card--I read a very cool "ghost/horror" story him by him once called Homebody. And he does have a connection w/Zindell: He just edited a Sci-Fi anthology called Future on Ice that features Shanidar, Zindell's award winning short story that became Neverness. I've been 2 hatrack once, will have 2 go again! How far do you fall Pilot?Edited by: danlo60 at: 6/11/02 4:23:36 pm



Foamfollower1013
Master Pilot


Joined: 01 May 2002
Posts: 149

Posted: 12 Jun 2002 19:27 Post subject: Re: Orson Scott Card - Ender's Game and other great stories.

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Yes, come to Hatrack, danlo. It's a really great place.

~Foamy~


King Mudd
Master Pilot


Joined: 28 Jun 2002
Posts: 112

Posted: 28 Jun 2002 21:49 Post subject: Re: Orson Scott Card - Ender's Game and other great stories.

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Ender's Game is prolly my favorite book of all time, and Speaker of the Dead is almost as good. Its too bad Xenocide and CotM aren't as good. What crazy person watches soccer at four in the mornin?



MsMary
Master Pilot


Joined: 29 Apr 2002
Posts: 777

Posted: 30 Jun 2002 18:45 Post subject: Re: Orson Scott Card - Ender's Game and other great stories.

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Yes, I agree, King Mudd, that Xenocide and COTM are not as good as Ender's Game and SftD. As I said above, SftD may well be OSC's best book. It's really a wonderful story.

Have you read Ender's Shadow? It is Ender's Game, retold from the POV of Bean, and is quite an interesting story.

And welcome to the Hangar, Mudd!

(I take it from your sig that you're a soccor fan? )

~MsMary~ "Does the walker choose the path, or the path the walker?"



King Mudd
Master Pilot


Joined: 28 Jun 2002
Posts: 112

Posted: 02 Jul 2002 23:27 Post subject: Re: Orson Scott Card - Ender's Game and other great stories.

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Thanx for the welcome, and yes I'm a soccer fan.

Yea I've read ES and SotH, and I can't wait til Shadow Puppets or whatever its called come out.

Game and Speaker are very very good because of the characters. Thats where X'cide and CotM and to a certain extent SotH goes wrong. It shifts a little bit away from the characters and more towards... I dunno... other things.

Although I thought Ender/Peter was hilarious when he "came to life". What crazy person watches soccer at four in the mornin?



Foamfollower1013
Master Pilot


Joined: 01 May 2002
Posts: 149

Posted: 03 Jul 2002 00:54 Post subject: Re: Orson Scott Card - Ender's Game and other great stories.

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I loved the banter between Peter and Wang-mu in CotM.

"I don't want to discuss my body with a man dressed in a badly planned, overgrown flower garden."



~Foamy~



erosye
Pilot


Joined: 09 Jul 2002
Posts: 1

Posted: 09 Jul 2002 11:55 Post subject: Ender's game

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Yes, Peter and Wang-mu's conversations are very cute!

Ender's Game and the whole series changed my outlook on science fiction. I have to admit that sci-fi never interested me until I read Orson Scott Card's books. Since then, I've actually come to enjoy some sci-fi books that I would have never consider reading in a million years.

Anyway, Shadow Puppets is coming out in August 19, which is next month. You can bet I'll be running to the bookstore! I've been waiting for a lonnnng time for the book! I can't wait!




danlo60
Master Pilot


Joined: 27 Mar 2002
Posts: 3468

Posted: 09 Jul 2002 17:08 Post subject: Re: Ender's game

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Welcome 2 the Hangar! erosye! Mathematics is a game. It's pieces are the axioms we create, and it's rules our logic. That mathematics is occasionally useful to mechanics and pilots is accidental -Mahavira Lal, third Lord Cantor



MsMary
Master Pilot


Joined: 29 Apr 2002
Posts: 777

Posted: 15 Jul 2002 16:08 Post subject: Re: Ender's game

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Allow me to add my welcome, erosye!

Always glad to see another OSC fan.

~MsMary~ "Does the walker choose the path, or the path the walker?"



MsMary
Master Pilot


Joined: 29 Apr 2002
Posts: 777

Posted: 19 Aug 2002 20:08 Post subject: Re: Ender's game

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Shadow Puppets, the next book in the Ender's Shadow series, came out today. Foamy and I ran out and got our copy and she's reading it.

Find out more about it and read the initial chapters here:

www.hatrack.com/osc/books...pets.shtml

~MsMary~ "Does the walker choose the path, or the path the walker?"




mhoram6901
Pilot


Joined: 28 Aug 2002
Posts: 18

Posted: 28 Aug 2002 19:31 Post subject: Bean

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I read Enders Game, it was very sad, very dark, but definitely worth my time. Im reading right now Enders Shadow, a book about Enders friend and de facto second in command, Im sure most of you know this but Im just clearing things up.



MsMary
Master Pilot


Joined: 29 Apr 2002
Posts: 777

Posted: 05 Sep 2002 22:07 Post subject: Shadow Puppets

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Shadow Puppets was great. But I wouldn't suggest you read it till after you have read Ender's Game, Ender's Shadow and Shadow of the Hegemon.

I am now on an Alvin Maker binge - more fantasy than scifi. SRD fans might find it interesting to see that the Alvin Maker series has a few elements in common with TCTC.

~MsMary~ "Does the walker choose the path, or the path the walker?"




MsMary
Master Pilot


Joined: 29 Apr 2002
Posts: 777

Posted: 15 Oct 2002 12:39 Post subject: Maps in a Mirror

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I bought a copy of OSC's out of print book of short stories, Maps in a Mirror, on ebay last month. OSC is a fabulous short story writer. His short stories may even be better than his novels. I have enjoyed every story I have read so far...and some of them are a little weird. (I actually took this book out of the library and started reading the stories before I took the plunge and bid on an ebay copy.) If you can get your hands on this book, I highly recommend it!

~MsMary~

P. S. Rumor has it he may be re-releasing the book. "Does the walker choose the path, or the path the walker?"



mhoram6910
Master Pilot


Joined: 31 Aug 2002
Posts: 1006

Posted: 18 Oct 2002 18:13 Post subject: Re: Maps in a Mirror

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Are they sci/fi? The planet he saw appeared to have continents that looked surprisingly like Northern Europe and North America. Ransom realized it was Earth he was seeing-Thulcandra, the Silent Planet

Posted: 20 Oct 2002 10:13 Post subject: Re: Maps in a Mirror

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Some of the stories are scifi, but overall the book contains a variety of genres, as OSC is not strictly a scifi writer. Some are sort of horror/suspense stories, some are fantasy. Very worthwhile reading, overall.

~MsMary~ "Does the walker choose the path, or the path the walker?"



MsMary
Master Pilot


Joined: 29 Apr 2002
Posts: 777

Posted: 30 Mar 2003 11:41 Post subject: Ender's Game short story

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Ender's Game originally appeared as a short story, in the August 1977 issue of Analog magazine.

It's interesting to see the differences between the short story and the book, but I wouldn't necessarily read the short story if you haven't read the book already, cause it will spoil the book for you.

If you have read the book and would like to read the short story, OSC has posted it at his website:

www.hatrack.com/osc/stori...game.shtml "Does the walker choose the path, or the path the walker?"Edited by: MsMaryMalone at: 3/30/03 9:42:32 am




MsMary
Master Pilot


Joined: 29 Apr 2002
Posts: 777

Posted: 30 Mar 2003 11:49 Post subject: First Meetings/Alvin Maker

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OSC will be publishing the book First Meetings in paperback - this book will contain 4 short stories that relate to the Ender's Game series.

The original hardcover, which came out for Endercon, has 3 of the stories(and they were very good!), so I will have to purchase the paperback to get the 4th story.

For those of you who have read the Alvin Maker books, OSC expects to finish Crystal City soon.

You can read all about it here:

www.hatrack.com/misc/firstmeetings.shtml

~MsMary~
"Does the walker choose the path, or the path the walker?"


Shiny
Pilot


Joined: 10 Dec 2002
Posts: 17

Posted: 26 Apr 2003 21:37 Post subject: Homecoming

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About two years ago, I checked out from my library, The Memory of Earth, The Call of Earth, and The Ships of Earth. They were wonderful, and the story has stuck with me these two years, so now, I'm back reading, and buying books, I've picked up the last two in the five part saga, Earthfall, and Earthborn. I'm only thrity pages into the first of the two, and I feel as though no time has passed since I last put down the series, it's really neat, he's so in depth in his characters personalities, their motivations and such. So, it's good so far, I'll let you know when I finish this book how it went. Ttfn



MsMary
Master Pilot


Joined: 29 Apr 2002
Posts: 777

Posted: 27 Apr 2003 12:42 Post subject: Re: Homecoming

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The Homecoming series is one that I haven't read yet.
Do keep us posted on how you like the rest of the series.

::adds it to my evergrowing TBR list::

~MsMary~ "Does the walker choose the path, or the path the walker?"




MsMary
Master Pilot


Joined: 29 Apr 2002
Posts: 777

Posted: 21 May 2003 09:12 Post subject: The Alvin Maker series

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OSC has announced the publication of The Crystal City, the next book in the Alvin Maker series, coming in November 2003.

~MsMary~ "Does the walker choose the path, or the path the walker?"




MsMary
Master Pilot


Joined: 29 Apr 2002
Posts: 777

Posted: 19 Nov 2003 12:15 Post subject: Re: The Alvin Maker series

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I am currently reading Pastwatch, a novel by OSC subtitled "The Redemption of Christopher Columbus." It's an odd story so far, about a future civilization on Earth that uses technology to look into the past and view scenes throughout past history. Very interesting to see where he is going to go with this idea.

~MsMary~ "Does the walker choose the path, or the path the walker?"



MsMary
Master Pilot


Joined: 29 Apr 2002
Posts: 777

Posted: 10 Mar 2004 13:14 Post subject: Re: The Alvin Maker series

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Maps in a Mirror, OSC's excellent collection of short stories, is now out in paperback.

The stories in the collection include stories in the scifi, fantasy, and horror genre, and are well-worth reading. I think OSC is even better at short stories than he is at novels.

For years, those of us who are Card fans could only obtain this book by searching for used or expensive signed copies on ebay (which is how I obtained my copy - fairly reasonably priced and unsigned, but I will get it signed eventually!). So this is very exciting news.

~MsMary~ "Does the walker choose the path, or the path the walker?"




taraswizard
Master Pilot


Joined: 01 Jun 2003
Posts: 615
Location: Chicago suburbs
Posted: 17 Jun 2005 23:59 Post subject: Re: Orson Scott Card - Ender's Game and other great stories.

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OK, I'm gonna burst MsMary's and foamfollower's bubble .

I read some scathing criticism of Ender's game written by John Kessel essay's title is "Creating the innocent killer" www4.ncsu,edu/~tenshi/Killer_000.htm . And based on this I decided to read EG for myself. Checked out from local public library today. More to follow. taraswizard
Allan Rosewarne N9SQT/WDX6HQV
Chicago area
W/T forever, always
Plan C - http://planc.bravepages.com/main.html




taraswizard
Master Pilot


Joined: 01 Jun 2003
Posts: 615
Location: Chicago suburbs
Posted: 22 Jun 2005 08:40 Post subject: Re: Orson Scott Card - Ender's Game and other great stories.

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OK, I'm about 2/3s through as a stylist, story teller and writer, OSC is phenomenal. However, considering the text, the circumstances of Andrew (Ender) Wiggin are beyond horrific, the behind the scenes manipulation and dissembling behavior, are monstrous. However, OSC wants us to have sympathy for the manipulators (IF officers, Battle school teachers, etc), since they are acting for the "noble purpose" of a higher good. This is a modern YA classic?

more to follow, maybe. taraswizard
Allan Rosewarne N9SQT/WDX6HQV
Chicago area
W/T forever, always
Plan C - http://planc.bravepages.com/main.html



MsMary
Master Pilot


Joined: 29 Apr 2002
Posts: 777

Posted: 22 Jun 2005 17:54 Post subject: Re: Orson Scott Card - Ender's Game and other great stories.

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Actually, I think Card wants us to have sympathy (and empathy) for Ender.

And I urge you to withold judgment till you get to the end, which holds some surprises.

And despite what you may think or what your opinion may be after you finish the book, I doubt it will burst any bubble of mine.

Btw, I couldn't get your link to work. "Does the walker choose the path, or the path the walker?"Edited by: MsMaryMalone at: 6/22/05 4:01 pm




taraswizard
Master Pilot


Joined: 01 Jun 2003
Posts: 615
Location: Chicago suburbs
Posted: 24 Jun 2005 01:08 Post subject: Re: Orson Scott Card - Ender's Game and other great stories.

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Ms Mary you have touched on one of the binaries also seen by Kessel; however, it is not a key piece of his argument. The readers are supposed to sympathize, identify and empathize with Ender. However, readers are certainly supposed to have sympathy for the IF command staff and runners of the Battle School, since they serve the higher purpose of saving humanity; regardless, that their methods to turn Andrew Wiggin into their tool are monstrous. taraswizard
Allan Rosewarne N9SQT/WDX6HQV
Chicago area
W/T forever, always
Plan C - http://planc.bravepages.com/main.html




MsMary
Master Pilot


Joined: 29 Apr 2002
Posts: 777

Posted: 24 Jun 2005 03:11 Post subject: Re: Orson Scott Card - Ender's Game and other great stories.

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Quote:However, readers are certainly supposed to have sympathy for the IF command staff and runners of the Battle School, since they serve the higher purpose of saving humanity

According to whom? According to Kessel? I already mentioned that I can't access your link, so I can't read the comments. Please provide a link that I can see.

Have you finished the book yet?

When you do, I challenge you to make your comments at OSC's forum, where he may have a chance to see and comment on your viewpoints. "Does the walker choose the path, or the path the walker?"



taraswizard
Master Pilot


Joined: 01 Jun 2003
Posts: 615
Location: Chicago suburbs
Posted: 24 Jun 2005 12:29 Post subject: Re: Orson Scott Card - Ender's Game and other great stories.

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Sorry Ms Mary 'bout the link to John Kessel's essay. Next message will contain the link only and I hope it works. Added the link in the next message should work. Of course, some would discount Kessel's essay as sour grapes since OS Card is a much more successful author, or as a response to Mr. Card's political views on current affairs (IOW, not truly about his themes and ideas in his writing).

Curious, is EG and OS Card popular outside the US? IMO, I can picture this type of story not being very popular outside the US. taraswizard
Allan Rosewarne N9SQT/WDX6HQV
Chicago area
W/T forever, always
Plan C - http://planc.bravepages.com/main.htmlEdited by: taraswizard at: 6/24/05 10:38 am




taraswizard
Master Pilot


Joined: 01 Jun 2003
Posts: 615
Location: Chicago suburbs
Posted: 24 Jun 2005 12:31 Post subject: Re: Orson Scott Card - Ender's Game J. Kessel's link

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www4.ncsu.edu/~tenshi/Killer_000.htm taraswizard
Allan Rosewarne N9SQT/WDX6HQV
Chicago area
W/T forever, always
Plan C - http://planc.bravepages.com/main.html


Post subject: Re: Orson Scott Card - Ender's Game J. Kessel's link

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Thanks Taras, the link works this time, and I will try to read it later when I get a bit more time.

I think that there is bit of backlash against Card right now, at least in some circles. I have been seeing some pretty vicious attacks on him at another board (that's an ezboard, and I don't know if those threads even still exit over there or not after the hacker attack)where I drop in from time to time. A lot of the attacks seemed to initially be aimed at his various political essays, then seemed to spread over to his books.

A lot of the people at that board seem to simply completely disagree with Card's political viewpoints, and that seems to have spilled over to his novels.

I am unsure (not having read this author as much as MsMary) whether there really is as much right wing political and conservative religious ideology pushing in his novels as the people over there claim, or if they are going out of their way to look for things because of their strong disagreement with his political essays. ******************************************************

Our lives are the songs that sing the universe into existence.~David Zindell




taraswizard
Master Pilot


Joined: 01 Jun 2003
Posts: 615
Location: Chicago suburbs
Posted: 24 Jun 2005 23:50 Post subject: Re: Orson Scott Card - Ender's Game J. Kessel's link

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Answering Ms Mary's question. I think one can easily conclude that the pushing of reader to a sympathetic view of the IF officer corps and the commandant's of the Battleschool, is in the text. Because almost every, if not every scene that contains these groups, the reader is given many references as to how these groups are so dedicated to their noble purpose (IOW, the saving of humanity's future from a "bugger" attack and invasion). These references are further buffered with textual evidence that these leaders are only manipulating Ender to form him into the perfect warrior against the bugger. Bottom line I do not think this view is something John Kessel pulled out of his butt.

Answering Duchess. I am aware of some of the controversy surrounding OS Card's political essays (BTW, he is not afraid to let views his out, when the announcement of the cancelling of Enterprise came out, he wrote another essay that basically said "good riddance"). The political essays have been discussed in the Hangar's political forum briefly. Interestingly, I read someplace that some of the higher up NeoCons in the Bush White House (C. Rice or maybe J. Bolton, maybe both) listed Ender's Game as one of their favorite books. taraswizard
Allan Rosewarne N9SQT/WDX6HQV
Chicago area
W/T forever, always
Plan C - http://planc.bravepages.com/main.html



Duchess of Malfi
Lady Scryer


Joined: 17 Nov 2002
Posts: 5974
Location: Michigan, USA
Posted: 25 Jun 2005 13:17 Post subject: Re: Orson Scott Card - Ender's Game and other great stories.

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Well, as I said, having only read a few of his books (Ender, the "Bean" books except for the last, the Alvin Maker books, and a couple of stand alones) I am hardly an expert on this man's work. MsMary would be much better able to answer questions about him than I would, having read much more.

Given that he does belong to a rather strict religion, I would think that it would be natural that some of his beliefs would come up in his work from time to time, subconciously if not deliberately.

Actually, one of the books I enjoyed the most was one where he openly talked about his religion, called Folks of the Fringe, sort of a post-apocalyptic science fiction story set in Utah... ******************************************************

Our lives are the songs that sing the universe into existence.~David Zindell




taraswizard
Master Pilot


Joined: 01 Jun 2003
Posts: 615
Location: Chicago suburbs
Posted: 07 Jul 2005 17:26 Post subject: Re: Orson Scott Card - Ender's Game

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Ok, I finished EG during my flight back from California last nite. And since reading John Kessel's review and criticism is very spoilery, I was not caught off guard nor very surprised by the ending. Another message will follow regarding specific questions and comments about the text, but since they will of necessity be spoilery extensive spoiler space will be used. Does anyone think OS Card's cards are a little thin and flat, and not very filled out. (FWIW, one could say that I feel a little about EG as I do about RotS, they're both OK, but I was really expecting more. For example the first time I read Dune or The mote in God's eye, or even Niven's World of Ptvaas, I was litterally blown away.) IOW, I heard all about this classic of modern day SF, I got this, instead. A point Kessel made and is not spoilery, does anyone else think EG might be to a particular type of young person EG might be seen as an horribly extreme example of wish fulfillment. (OT example, I was talking over a year ago with a friend in California (BTW she is 10 or so yrs younger than me), she is a big BtVS fan, and we were discussin it's suitability to young people, and she said using her 10 yr old or about nephew, that in her opinion showing him magic as force to be used was not good since he was becoming aware of people who are deliberately mean and cruel sometimes to him and his wanting to do something about that. Does anyone see EG having a similar role)? (FWIW, this last bit of discussion bears directly on Kessel's essay) taraswizard
Allan Rosewarne N9SQT/WDX6HQV
Chicago area
W/T forever, always
Plan C - http://planc.bravepages.com/main.html



MsMary
Master Pilot


Joined: 29 Apr 2002
Posts: 777

Posted: 11 Jul 2005 00:20 Post subject: Re: Orson Scott Card - Ender's Game

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Quote:Does anyone think OS Card's cards are a little thin and flat, and not very filled out. (FWIW, one could say that I feel a little about EG as I do about RotS, they're both OK, but I was really expecting more. For example the first time I read Dune or The mote in God's eye, or even Niven's World of Ptvaas, I was litterally blown away.)

When I first read Ender's Game, I was blown away by the ending. Of course, you spoiled it for yourself by reading Kessel's essay first. Also, I view Ender's Game in the context of the sequels, especially Speaker for the Dead, which is a much more complex and philosophical book, definitely not thin and flat. And Ender's Game in novel version (as opposed to the original short story) was definitely written as background and preparation for the sequel, Speaker for the Dead. "Does the walker choose the path, or the path the walker?"



taraswizard
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Posted: 11 Jul 2005 02:13 Post subject: Re: Orson Scott Card - Ender's Game

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OK, yes the Kessel essay spoils the ending. But, still IMhO, I do not necessarily think it's that big a deal. Additionally, the ending does come out of left field and AFAIK is there to set up Speaker for the Dead. Maybe, I'll go ahead and read SftD. taraswizard
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taraswizard
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Posted: 11 Jul 2005 14:44 Post subject: Re: OSC - questions, comments and thoughts

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s
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this
is
spoiler
space
go
beyond
only
if
you've
already
read
Ender'ss
Game
or
if
you
do
not
care
if
you
get
spoiled
s
p
o
i
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s
p
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space
you
have
been
warned

Since Ender's Game is classified as a text of juvenile/young adult literature, I know for certain it has a message and a higher purpose (IOW, more than just a "rip roarin yarn").

So that leads to the following:
1) Is it acceptable and a good thing to do "bad things" for good (higher purpose) reasons? Ender commits genocide against the buggers, but because it is to save humanity that makes it acceptable. And how does Ender's guilt over the issue figure into it. (I know it must be important, because Card obssesses over Ender's guilt)

2)Is it acceptable to do "good things" on account of "bad motivations"? Peter Wiggins is a protrayed as a sociopathic, sadistic jerk, but because in his egotistical quest for control of everything the Earth is brought into an period of World Peace and the initiation of space colonization. Those results are certainly protrayed in the text as a good end.

2a) The entire IF command (Battle school and command school staff included) manipulate Ender with callous disregard for well being and welfare. It's OK because their goal is saving humanity.

3) It's acceptable to annihilate your enemies as long as they're really, really "bad"; IOW, no retaliation is excessive nor is a striking the first blow as long as you're in the "right". One can conclude, Stiltson, Bonzo (and by extension 'the buggers') only got what was coming to them.

4) Is there any truth to the IF's criteria for a successful commander? The explanation given by Mazer Rackham (combining ruthlessness with compassion and empathy) just seems to me to a load of crap.

5) Why does Peter Wiggins escape his "just reward"? IMO, he deserved the same fate Stiltson and Bonzo.

6) Why doesn't any character do the right things for the right reasons?

I know some of this analyses sounds rather harsh and comes off sounding like I did not like Ender's game, and that far from the facts since I actually liked it. taraswizard
Allan Rosewarne N9SQT/WDX6HQV
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Plan C - http://planc.bravepages.com/main.htmlEdited by: taraswizard at: 7/11/05 12:47 pm



MsMary
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Posted: 11 Jul 2005 19:13 Post subject: Re: OSC - questions, comments and thoughts

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I am going to take issue with your first statement here without reading any farther:

Quote:Since Ender's Game is classified as a text of juvenile/young adult literature, I know for certain it has a message and a higher purpose (IOW, more than just a "rip roarin yarn" .

Ender's Game was not written with the young adult/juvenile audience in mind. It was written as an adult scifi short story and was initially published in Analog Magazine. When it was novelized, it was, again, written as an adult scifi novel. It only started being marketed to the young adult audience in the last few years, due to the tremendous interest in the story among young adults. "Does the walker choose the path, or the path the walker?"



taraswizard
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Posted: 28 Jul 2005 16:50 Post subject: Re: OSC - questions, comments and thoughts

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Y'know I would really like to claim the classification of Ender's Game as my own, if only I was smart enough to be do something like that. I only know this classification of EG as juvenile/YA book by its reputation. Furthermore, on the back cover of the library's copy Quote:According to America Library Association: one of the 100 best books for Teens and since I do not know what the other 99 other entries are on ALA's list, I cannot judge if all were intended to be juvenile/YA books. taraswizard
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DRAGONEMISIS
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Posted: 02 Aug 2005 09:05 Post subject: Ender'sGame

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TW, without having a shot at you, I fail to see how anyone who had actually read Ender could classify it as a teen-book.

I'm sure they'd enjoy it, (it's got lots of blood and action and stuff, after all,) but I doubt they'd understand it. Not the underlying story. Not the psychopathic violence, the confusion, the guilt.

It isn't Harry Potter after all.

Adios









taraswizard
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Posted: 02 Aug 2005 13:19 Post subject: Re: Ender'sGame

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Dragon, one must presume someone with the American Library Assoc. (ALA) read Ender's Game before making the statement. And even if you're reluctant to admit, IMO, you agree with me concerning EG. However, FWIW, you should probably read John Kessell's essay (link is on another post) about the book, and some of your points are made in his essagy, I think. taraswizard
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Posted: 02 Aug 2005 14:25 Post subject: Re: Ender'sGame

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I've always sort of wondered why Ender's Game is marketed at teens. At least, that's where its kept with the books in our local book stores -- right there with the YA books. I was not aware that it was originally marketed for adults.

The sequels and the parrallel "Bean" series are all marketed to adults, so I had always sort of questioned that...

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DRAGONEMISIS
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Posted: 07 Aug 2005 06:21 Post subject: Re: Ender'sGame

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TW...I'm confused.

Did you agree with me...or not ?

Adios



MsMary
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Posted: 08 Aug 2005 11:26 Post subject: Re: Ender'sGame

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Ender's Game was not originally written as a teen ("Young Adult") story. It was written as a scifi story for adults. The marketing aimed at teens came long after the fact, due to the interest teens have shown in the story. "Does the walker choose the path, or the path the walker?"




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Posted: 16 Sep 2007 00:33 Post subject:

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I read Treason, an older OSC novel, over the weekend. Very strange and interesting story.


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Posted: 16 Sep 2007 23:39 Post subject:

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Never heard of it. Apart from the Enders and Alvin books, I don' think I've read anything else by him. (And I've still only read the 1st three Maker books. *sigh* )

--A
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MsMary
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Posted: 17 Sep 2007 01:40 Post subject:

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You can read Chapter One of Treason here, if you wish. As I said, it's an interesting story.



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Thanks MsMary, looks interesting.

--A
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Posted: 03 Feb 2008 11:30 Post subject:

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Enders Game is a favorite of Mine, and now of my son. I understand there is a movie this year!




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Posted: 03 Feb 2008 13:50 Post subject:

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iQ! iQ! iQ!

Hi!!



Yeah...Beorn read the entire series in 6th grade and took AR quizzes on them. He is seriously looking forward to the movie(s).
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Posted: 04 Feb 2008 02:36 Post subject:

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iquestor wrote:
Enders Game is a favorite of Mine, and now of my son. I understand there is a movie this year!


Ender's Game is a great book, as are Speaker for the Dead and Xenocide.

About the movie...don't hold your breath. It's been talked about for years, but has never gotten beyond the talking stage.
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Re: Orson Scott Card - Ender's Game and other great stories (res

Postby Avatar » Wed May 20, 2009 5:19 pm

I just reread the Ender series, (having recently completed my collection by picking up Speaker), and I've come to the conclusion that I enjoyed the Shadow series maybe more than the originals. Certainly more than Ender's Game anyway...speaker and Xenocide are better for different reasons.

I also thought that the ending of Xenocide was a bit bloody Deus Ex...

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Re: Orson Scott Card - Ender's Game and other great stories (res

Postby MsMary » Fri May 22, 2009 1:41 am

I recently re-read the series, too. I like the Ender series better than the Shadow series.
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Re: Orson Scott Card - Ender's Game and other great stories (res

Postby Avatar » Fri May 22, 2009 11:51 am

I think I just preferred Bean's perspective on Ender's Game more than Ender's. When Bean figures out that their games are actually real people dying...and when he sends that last message to the ships Ender is aiming at the alien homeworld...Ender not knowing that real people are in them...

Was a great book.

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Re: Orson Scott Card - Ender's Game and other great stories (res

Postby MsMary » Fri May 22, 2009 9:21 pm

I'm not convinced. ;)

Then again, I read the Ender's series long before the Shadow series ever came out, so I don't view them all on equal footing.
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Re: Orson Scott Card - Ender's Game and other great stories (res

Postby Avatar » Thu May 28, 2009 7:52 pm

I read ender and Ender's Shadow at pretty much the same time.

Got the GF reading Ender's Game, and she's loving it.

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Re: Orson Scott Card - Ender's Game and other great stories (res

Postby jacobRaver » Fri Aug 21, 2009 10:59 pm

Speaker is absolutely one of my all-timers...EG is a scifi gateway drug, X and CotM are good...I ate up the first Bean novel, but lost interest halfway through the second, just didn't seem like much plot, nothing really interesting...sorry, blasphemer! (I cried when
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Re: Orson Scott Card - Ender's Game and other great stories (res

Postby Avatar » Sat Aug 22, 2009 10:30 pm

Yeah, the first Bean book was the best. And Speaker is great. But Xenocide has a weak ending I think.

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Re: Orson Scott Card - Ender's Game and other great stories (res

Postby jacobRaver » Thu Sep 10, 2009 9:19 pm

I believe I read that Xenocide and Children were written together...which doesn't make the weak ending okay, but at least explains the liklihood.
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Re: Orson Scott Card - Ender's Game and other great stories (res

Postby Avatar » Fri Sep 11, 2009 3:27 pm

Could be. It's a shame really...I'd forgotten how it ended, and was really enjoying the whole tension of the descolada dilemma, then abracadabra and it's solved.

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