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 Post subject: Kassad and Keats III
PostPosted: Wed Dec 24, 2003 4:04 pm 
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SOME SPOILER QUESTIONS BELOW, IF YOU HAVEN'T READ THE ENDYMION BOOKS.-------------------------------------------------------

I just finished Rise of Endymion, but I am still confused about a couple of things:

1) What is the chronology for Colonel Kassad? He was moved through time by the Shrike and ended up fighting the legions of shrikes in the future. Then he died in battle and was sent back through time via the time tombs. How is it possible that he is OLDER in the Rise of Endymion and DOESN'T KNOW Rachel? He has been seeing Rachel in his dreams since he was in his twenties and yet he doesn't know who she is? It seems that they have never been together, yet he is already old. He also indicates that he arrived some months ago, yet Aenea says that he served the cause for years and will continue to do so for years.

So to summarize, what exactly is the chronology for Kassad (from his point of view)?

2) I don't recall how the Aenea's father (Keats II) got into the Consul's ship? Wasn't he killed by Ummon?

3) Whatever happened to Keats III? He is hardly mentioned in the Endymion books.


Thanks for any help you can provide on these questions. <i></i>


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 Post subject: Re: Kassad and Keats III
PostPosted: Wed Dec 24, 2003 5:47 pm 
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I have always been a bit confused by the chronology of Kassad myself. The man is slipped around through hundreds and hundreds of years of time...I think the mention you are making of Rachel is that in HER particular timeline she had not yet become Kassad's lover...her timeline is confusing, too, as she lives one life, then slips backwards, then forwards, then moves around through those same millennia....as both serve Aenea's cause, and cross each other and themselves again and again through time...
It's just that at this particular point in time, Rachel, while having the knowledge of what she and Kassad will be to each other, is just taking the first steps on that journey...
(Hopefully Kali Shrike will drop in - I have the feeling he might be able to answer this question better than I).

As to Keatses, as far as I recall without rechecking, there were two of them. The first was killed. The second became embedded in a neural shunt, which allowed him to communicate with Aenea before she was born, and he is the one who merged himself with the Ship for awhile. ******************************************************

Our lives are the songs that sing the universe into existence.~David Zindell
<i></i>


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 Post subject: Re: Kassad and Keats III (Some spoilers)
PostPosted: Thu Dec 25, 2003 2:41 am 
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Regarding Keats, there were actually 3 I think. The first was briefly mentioned in Hyperion I think, but went mad or something like that, and not much was mentioned more about him. The second was Aenea's father and he was killed by Ummon. The third was the main character of Fall of Hyperion and was created after Aenea's father was killed by Ummon. He is the one who called himself Joseph Severn and died on Old Earth and he is the one who saved the baby from the Shrike (though it was a bit unclear on how he did that). We don't know what happened to Keats III (Joseph Severn), except that he seemed to be visiting the metasphere and then going into the ship. This is fine, but the problem is that Aenea said that her FATHER joined with the ship, not her uncle (Joseph Severn). But her father was killed by Ummon, so I am very confused as to who went into the ship. <i></i>


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 Post subject: Re: Kassad and Keats III
PostPosted: Thu Dec 25, 2003 2:49 am 
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Regarding Rachel's timeline, my thought was that she got sick with Merlin sickness, aged backwards, went with Sol into the future as a baby and then grew up and was sent backward in time to her future, but our past where she would eventually meet Kassad (remember it seemed that his future was her past and vice versa). At some point, she is sent into the future with Kassad and they fight the legion of shrikes. Again, the problem is that Kassad should know all about this since he is OLD and since she has not met him yet based on the fact that they are moving in opposite directions in time. In Hyperion, as he knows more about her, she knows less about him.

So Hyperion doesn't seem to jive with Rise of Endymion, where Rachel knows she will love Kassad in the future (in Hyperion, this was never the case), and Kassad is OLD and doesn't even know who Rachel is, yet in Hyperion, he knew of her when he was in his twenties.

I think Dan Simmons, or some Hyperion guru needs to do some serious explaining to have these two characters' timelines make any kind of sense. <i></i>


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 Post subject: Re: Kassad and Keats III
PostPosted: Fri Jan 16, 2004 7:30 pm 
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One thing about Dan Simmons is that he likes his readers to do some serious thinking. He is not the sort of writer who "spoon feeds" his readers...a lot of things I get from his books in a more intutitive fashion than from other more straightforward means. (As an example of this is the Egyptian mythology that runs in the background of two of his related horror books. After months of thought, I think I understand some of what is going on with that, but I might never know if I have the right answer or not).
This is actually one of the reasons I like Dan Simmons as an author. He has many levels of meaning, and many levels of possibilities. And I love that in his books. Will I ever have all of the answers? Oh no, never. But I can think of them for months at a time, and not many authors have that affect on me. ******************************************************

Our lives are the songs that sing the universe into existence.~David Zindell
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 Post subject: Re: Kassad and Keats III
PostPosted: Wed Jan 21, 2004 7:09 pm 
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I understand what you say and I agree. However, I think Dan Simmons would prefer for people to do some thinking on the meaning of what transpires in the books as opposed to what actually transpires (in my opinion). What would be the point of attempting to figure what he had in mind in terms of the events of the book? This kind of ambiguity makes it more difficult to get to the heart of what he is trying to discuss. I am not talking about leaving certain things unsaid. This is fine and not everything in a book has to be revealed. I am talking about clearing up contradictions and confusions. With Kassad, I simply am completely confused as to what happened in Hyperion and what happened in the Endymion books. It seems like he magically appeared there and was far older than described in the Hyperion books. His relationship with Rachel doesn't seem to make much sense. They know each other early on in Hyperion, but they don't seem to know each other well in Endymion, so what is going on? Even a little clarification here would be helpful. <i></i>


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