[phpBB Debug] PHP Notice: in file /includes/bbcode.php on line 483: preg_replace(): The /e modifier is no longer supported, use preg_replace_callback instead
[phpBB Debug] PHP Notice: in file /includes/bbcode.php on line 483: preg_replace(): The /e modifier is no longer supported, use preg_replace_callback instead
[phpBB Debug] PHP Notice: in file /includes/bbcode.php on line 483: preg_replace(): The /e modifier is no longer supported, use preg_replace_callback instead
[phpBB Debug] PHP Notice: in file /includes/bbcode.php on line 483: preg_replace(): The /e modifier is no longer supported, use preg_replace_callback instead
[phpBB Debug] PHP Notice: in file /includes/bbcode.php on line 483: preg_replace(): The /e modifier is no longer supported, use preg_replace_callback instead
[phpBB Debug] PHP Notice: in file /includes/bbcode.php on line 483: preg_replace(): The /e modifier is no longer supported, use preg_replace_callback instead
[phpBB Debug] PHP Notice: in file /includes/bbcode.php on line 483: preg_replace(): The /e modifier is no longer supported, use preg_replace_callback instead
[phpBB Debug] PHP Notice: in file /includes/bbcode.php on line 483: preg_replace(): The /e modifier is no longer supported, use preg_replace_callback instead
[phpBB Debug] PHP Notice: in file /includes/bbcode.php on line 483: preg_replace(): The /e modifier is no longer supported, use preg_replace_callback instead
[phpBB Debug] PHP Notice: in file /includes/bbcode.php on line 483: preg_replace(): The /e modifier is no longer supported, use preg_replace_callback instead
[phpBB Debug] PHP Notice: in file /includes/bbcode.php on line 483: preg_replace(): The /e modifier is no longer supported, use preg_replace_callback instead
[phpBB Debug] PHP Notice: in file /includes/bbcode.php on line 483: preg_replace(): The /e modifier is no longer supported, use preg_replace_callback instead
[phpBB Debug] PHP Notice: in file /includes/bbcode.php on line 483: preg_replace(): The /e modifier is no longer supported, use preg_replace_callback instead
[phpBB Debug] PHP Notice: in file /includes/bbcode.php on line 483: preg_replace(): The /e modifier is no longer supported, use preg_replace_callback instead
[phpBB Debug] PHP Notice: in file /includes/bbcode.php on line 483: preg_replace(): The /e modifier is no longer supported, use preg_replace_callback instead
[phpBB Debug] PHP Notice: in file /includes/bbcode.php on line 483: preg_replace(): The /e modifier is no longer supported, use preg_replace_callback instead
[phpBB Debug] PHP Notice: in file /includes/bbcode.php on line 483: preg_replace(): The /e modifier is no longer supported, use preg_replace_callback instead
[phpBB Debug] PHP Notice: in file /includes/bbcode.php on line 483: preg_replace(): The /e modifier is no longer supported, use preg_replace_callback instead
[phpBB Debug] PHP Notice: in file /includes/bbcode.php on line 483: preg_replace(): The /e modifier is no longer supported, use preg_replace_callback instead
[phpBB Debug] PHP Notice: in file /includes/bbcode.php on line 483: preg_replace(): The /e modifier is no longer supported, use preg_replace_callback instead
[phpBB Debug] PHP Notice: in file /includes/bbcode.php on line 483: preg_replace(): The /e modifier is no longer supported, use preg_replace_callback instead
[phpBB Debug] PHP Notice: in file /includes/bbcode.php on line 483: preg_replace(): The /e modifier is no longer supported, use preg_replace_callback instead
[phpBB Debug] PHP Notice: in file /includes/bbcode.php on line 483: preg_replace(): The /e modifier is no longer supported, use preg_replace_callback instead
[phpBB Debug] PHP Notice: in file /includes/bbcode.php on line 483: preg_replace(): The /e modifier is no longer supported, use preg_replace_callback instead
[phpBB Debug] PHP Notice: in file /includes/bbcode.php on line 483: preg_replace(): The /e modifier is no longer supported, use preg_replace_callback instead
[phpBB Debug] PHP Notice: in file /includes/bbcode.php on line 483: preg_replace(): The /e modifier is no longer supported, use preg_replace_callback instead
[phpBB Debug] PHP Notice: in file /includes/bbcode.php on line 112: preg_replace(): The /e modifier is no longer supported, use preg_replace_callback instead
[phpBB Debug] PHP Notice: in file /includes/bbcode.php on line 112: preg_replace(): The /e modifier is no longer supported, use preg_replace_callback instead
[phpBB Debug] PHP Notice: in file /includes/functions.php on line 4183: Cannot modify header information - headers already sent by (output started at /includes/functions.php:3493)
[phpBB Debug] PHP Notice: in file /includes/functions.php on line 4185: Cannot modify header information - headers already sent by (output started at /includes/functions.php:3493)
[phpBB Debug] PHP Notice: in file /includes/functions.php on line 4186: Cannot modify header information - headers already sent by (output started at /includes/functions.php:3493)
[phpBB Debug] PHP Notice: in file /includes/functions.php on line 4187: Cannot modify header information - headers already sent by (output started at /includes/functions.php:3493)
Ahira's Hangar • View topic - Fatal Revevant part 2 chapter 12 -- extreme spoilers!!!!!

Ahira's Hangar

David Zindell's Neverness, A Requiem for Homo Sapiens and all things Science Fiction and Fantasy
It is currently Sun Nov 10, 2024 7:25 pm

All times are UTC




Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 10 posts ] 
Author Message
 Post subject: Fatal Revevant part 2 chapter 12 -- extreme spoilers!!!!!
PostPosted: Mon Oct 29, 2007 5:59 pm 
Offline
Lady Scryer
User avatar

Joined: Sun Nov 17, 2002 5:11 pm
Posts: 9653
Location: Michigan, USA
Well, this is it - the end of the road for this book. :( Yes, it makes me sad, and the wait for the next book (the one whose title was changed to something odd that I cannot remember) will be very long, indeed. :cry:

And, as always, I do not have enough time. I have an hour before I have to leave for work. I doubt I can finish everything up in this time frame, so will probably be back in the middle of the night to work on it some more. :wink:

I probably will be making one or two more threads for this book, also well marked for spoilers. One will be an annex thread for part two chapter six, when I attempt to make a flowchart for the confusing events of that chapter. :razz:

I may or may not also make a thread where I (or anyone else as well! :) ) can work on their reviews for Amazon or Amazon.ca or Amazon.co.uk. :D 8) Now that thread would/should be spoiler free, as the reviews themselves should be as spoiler free as possible. :) 8)

And here we go... :shock:

[spoiler]


TRUST YOURSELF, a rather ominous title for a chapter when Linden plans on going against the advice of both her enemies and her friends. And - it is a paradox, for while Linden will be trusting herself in doing so - she is doing it because she has so little faith in herself. The only thing that kept me going in this chapter is that

there is hope in contradiction.

Linden and her party wait on the riverbank, talking and trying to figure out how to deal with the waiting Harrow. Linden asks Stave about how Morinmoss redeemed the Covenant. It is unclear what she is looking for, other than an answer of how much she will might to pay in a deal with the Insequent. :?

Linden decides that she will talk to him, but make no decisions until they reach the krill.

As night grows near, the Ranyhyn carry the party across the cold river. They face the Harrow at the last little bit of sunset... :?

(Yes, all of this talk of sunset and the end of day is very ominous, and is foreshadowing of what will happen later in this chapter). :(

The Harrow tells Linden that he can come to Andelain, but Kastenessen, Esmer, and Roger are all blocked.

Linden starts hearing a strange noise, too elusive and far away for her to identify it. She decides to ignore it for now, and asks more questions to the Harrow about how some are blocked from Andelain and others are not.

Why not Anele, for example, as he is stuffed with Earthpower?

Because Anele means no harm, of course, and his power is from Andelain.

Why not Longwrath?

It is because he carries a magic sword, made by Kasryn of the Gyre - designed to kill Sandgogons. :shock: :shock: :shock:

Now, if that is not some great foreshadowing of things to come later in the series, I do not know what it could be! :D 8) Who knows if Longwrath will come to his senses and use the sword against the gorgons, or someone else will, but Donaldson would never have a sword like this if he is not planning on using it. :woohoo: :woohoo: :woohoo:

Now, the Insequent seems to be the only other person who can hear the strange sounds that Linden is hearing. He says that :

Far greater beings walk the Hills, among them one of vast arrogance and self-worship.

As the sound comes closer, it is the sound of bells. :shock: :shock: :shock:

Linden knows that sound well - it is the sound of the Elohim. :shock: :shock: :shock:

And sure enough - it the Queen of the Elohim, Infelice. :shock: :shock:

How bad are things about to get is this supremely self-absorbed being is about to try to intervene? :faint:

It is quickly obvious that there is some sort of bad blood between the Insequent and the Elohim. The Theomach has said as much, and the Vizard has wanted Jeremiah to trap them. Infelice and the Harrow do not like each other, not at all.

It soon becomes clear that Infelice has come to try to convince Linden to give up her secret plans for the krill. :?

Linden grows tires of their banter, and tells her party to come on - let us go get the krill. The Harrow and Infelice can tag along if they like...

And the wraiths come, as an escort...

We discover from the Harrow, that this night is Banas Nimoran, the dark of the moon on the middle night of spring - something which happens once in a generation, and a time once of great joy with the Celebration of Spring, then of horror ever since the wraiths were interrupted in their dance... :o Bad things happen on this night in the Chronicles. The wraiths were attacked by ur-viles. The moon turned illearth green and gave the signal for the Giant Raver to attack Revelstone and the Lords. :(

Infelice tells Linden that the Elohim and the Insequent share one thing - that neither wants to see the Earth end. And the Harrow sings an ominous song about the end of all things.

Infelice tells Linden that the shadow on the hearts of the Elohim is the fear of mortals such as Linden and the Timewarden (Is that Thomas Covenant????) who have enough power to destroy the world. :shock:

She tells Linden plainly that she is on course to ruin the Earth and serve Lord Foul. :shock:

And so this is the way the world ends -

And so they reach the krill.

And a desperate Infelice says that she is here to prevent this very moment:
Broken or triumphant in the past, you would not have returned to the Land. You would not now hold white gold and the Staff of Law. Nor would you approach Loric's krill in Andelain accompanied by Wraiths. You would not be driven by mistaken love to bring about the end of all things.

Linden just blows her off.... :shock: :shock: :shock:

And Infelice tries again:
Have you heard me? We stand now at the last crisis of the Earth. If you do not turn aside, you will be broken indeed. Your remorse will surpass your strength to bear it.

Again, Linden blows her off, and calls out to Covenant.

In answer, two figures come. They are Sunder and Hollian. They do not look or speak to Linden. They take Anele and his Ranyhyn away.

Then another of Linden's dead comes - Grimmand Honninscrave, the Captain of Starfare's Gem. He takes away the living Giants.

Infelice tries once again:
These are your dead. Their love for you is not forgotten. Yet they shun you. They seek to spare their descendants the peril of your intent. If you will not heed them, heed me.

And the Harrow even tries:
You have also been made blind, lady...There is a Kevin's Dirt of the soul as there is of the flesh...

She calls again for Covenant.

But she gets her dead haruchai, Cail, Ceer, and Herfrom, among others that she knew in the time of the Second Chrons, instead.

But Stave and the Masters stay. Stave tells Linden that other spirits are coming, spirits which cannot be denied, and who will come to make sure that Linden is able to make her choice freely. Her other dead are clearing the way for them. :? :shock: :? :shock:

Also, the dead cannot speak to Linden at this time and place.

This reminds me so much of the Trial of Silence at Mithil Stonedown in The Wounded Land. Covenant and Linden were put to trial in a bizarre way where no one would talk to them. Their words and actions would prove their innocence or guilt.

And so the dead put Linden on trial. :shock:

It turns out that the spirits who can command the dead are the four great High Lords of antiquity - Berek, Damelon, Loric, and Kevin.

And this about Damelon:
As he aged he put on girth: Dead he implied the bulk of mountains against the background of Andelian's darkness and the black heavens. To Linden's shaken stare, he replied with a beatific smile.

A large man with a beautiful smile - can there be any doubt left at all that Donaldson has been rummaging through old photo albums at the Watch? :razz: :razz: I think he pays more attention to the Watch and the members there than he is willing to admit. :razz: :razz: As this description of Damelon prooves. :razz: :razz:

And I must stop at this point; time to head in to work. More later, unless someone else wishes to finish up - if that is the case, I will not mind. :wink: :lol:


[/spoiler]


to be continued...

_________________
Our lives are the songs that sing the universe into existence.~David Zindell

Image Image Image




Last edited by Duchess of Malfi on Tue Feb 19, 2008 3:23 am, edited 1 time in total.

Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Tue Oct 30, 2007 5:07 am 
Offline
Lady Scryer
User avatar

Joined: Sun Nov 17, 2002 5:11 pm
Posts: 9653
Location: Michigan, USA
continuation:






[spoiler]


So here we go.

It is the dark of the moon on the middle night of spring.

We are in Andelain. We have wraiths. We have the spirits of the four greatest of the Old High Lords. We have Liand, the three Humbled, the three Ramen, several of the Ranyhyn, Stave, Queen Infelice of the elohim, and the Harrow of the Insequent. We have Linden, who bears both the Staff of Law and the white gold ring. I hope I have everyone. :wink:

We are standing in the place of Lorc's krill, a legendary implement that is not only a kickass weapon, but is said to be able to channel any amount of power.

But there is no sign of Thomas Covevant, living or dead.

Stave tells Linden that the time has coem for her to act on what is in her heart.

And she cries out that Covenant is not here!

Stave tells her that she must call on the Law Breakers.

And he clearly disapproves of what she is doing... :?

But Linden disregards him, as she has everyone and everything else. :(

She calls upon Elena and Hile Troy.

The Law-Breakers, dead and broken; doomed. The ghosts of all that the Land had lost.

But the spirits of Elena and Troy bring Thomas Coveanant's spirit with them. :?

...he had gone beyond recognition. He was no more human than the stars: a being of such illimitable lonliness and grandeur that he both defied and deified understanding.

And he does not seem to approve of what Linden is doing, either.


On the far side of Loric's embedded blade, he halted. There he stood with his arms folded like denial across his chest...His eyes bled nacre on her nehalf. But he shook his head. Harsh as a blow, he raised his halfhand to cover his mouth.

Linden has found Covenant, but he will not talk to her. She must make her own choice, for good or ill... :?

Infelice makes one last plea for Linden to stop, but she also refuses to help Linden find and rescue Jeremiah, Linden makes her choice.

Then the Humbled forbid Linden from taking the krill. The Ranyhyn and the Ramen prevent the Humbled from interfering.

She calls up the power of both Staff and Ring and channel them with all of her might into Loric's krill. She had been told that she was not the ring's rightful wielder, and therefore the amount of power she can call from the ring is limited - but that certainly does not seem to be the case...

Her power is that of a god.

And she uses that power to bring Thomas Covenant back to life. :faint:

Infelice tells them all that Linden has awakened the Worm of World's End.

And the Ranyhyn, who have warned Linden, sound as if they mourn. :(

And so the novel ends, without our knowing whether or not the Earth will be destroyed, and how long that will take.

Yet, there is hope in contradiction.

Perhaps a destruction or partial destruction of the Earth is necessary as a cleansing, from Foul and other banes.

Perhaps destruction can lead to a new creation.

And what about Anele, being the hope of the Land after Linden brings doom? And Anele telling Linden to look for the oldest rock? What could be in the oldest rock other than the echoes of creation?

And Donaldson did give us big clues as to some of the things thta might happen in the next book - from traveling to Mount Thunder to cleanse the Land of Kevins' Dirt, to a magic sword made to use agsinst Sandgorgons.

I think that there is quite a bit of story left. :wink:


[/spoiler]

_________________
Our lives are the songs that sing the universe into existence.~David Zindell

Image Image Image




Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Tue Oct 30, 2007 8:45 am 
Offline
Master Pilot
User avatar

Joined: Mon Jun 27, 2005 5:34 am
Posts: 1559
Location: Winnipeg, Canada
[spoiler]


Interesting that, like the ending of Runes, FR also ends with the appearance of Thomas Covenant - but this time, it's for real. I think.

An astounding end to an astounding book! Now we have plenty of time to ponder what it all means. :wink:

FR is a riveting piece of work! Bravo, SRD!

Linden...I don't know what to say about what she's done. The implications are so...cosmic. But she did trust herself. Since the Dead apparently no longer give advice, Linden was really left to her own devices. I don't know what this change in the Dead's "policy" signifies. Why can't they give advice anymore? Does it go back to free will? They don't want to contaminate Linden's choices by talking to her? She must be absolutely free to save or damn the Earth? But Sunder and Hollian (and Covenant) have spoken to her via Anele and so have influenced her.



[/spoiler]


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Wed Oct 31, 2007 11:30 pm 
Offline
Lady Scryer
User avatar

Joined: Sun Nov 17, 2002 5:11 pm
Posts: 9653
Location: Michigan, USA

_________________
Our lives are the songs that sing the universe into existence.~David Zindell

Image Image Image




Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Thu Nov 01, 2007 1:44 pm 
Offline
Master Pilot
User avatar

Joined: Sat Sep 13, 2003 3:10 am
Posts: 177
One word...

WOW!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! :faint:

_________________
Love's Divine


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Thu Nov 01, 2007 8:59 pm 
Offline
Master Pilot
User avatar

Joined: Mon Jun 27, 2005 5:34 am
Posts: 1559
Location: Winnipeg, Canada
Yeah, it's a WOW! book all right. :)


[spoiler]


In contrast to the deliberately subdued ROTE, FR is a huge rollercoaster ride. Just by virtue of the fact we visited legends of a distant age (Berek, Damelon, the Viles, Caerroil Wildwood), the Land seems much more ALIVE now. Intersections are happening.

And what of Linden's intersection of wild magic, Staff and krill that has "recreated" Thomas Covenant? As he said in apparent horror: "Oh, Linden, what have you done?"

Indeed, what has she done? Sure, according to Infelice, she has awakened the Worm (if you accept the word of an Elohim). But aside from that, what kind of being has Linden "created" in Covenant? In WGW, Lord Foul had (inadvertently or not) burned Covenant free of the venom, thereby transforming him into pure, unstained wild magic. Right? But what is he now? An uneasy alloy of wild magic and Earthpower? If not, what then?

Linden, what the heck have you done to poor ol' Tom??



[/spoiler]


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Thu Nov 01, 2007 9:28 pm 
Offline
Lady Scryer
User avatar

Joined: Sun Nov 17, 2002 5:11 pm
Posts: 9653
Location: Michigan, USA
All very good questions, and it will be a long, hard wait until we get some answers. :wink:

And I bet Donaldson will surprise us when we get those answers, too! :shock:

_________________
Our lives are the songs that sing the universe into existence.~David Zindell

Image Image Image




Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Fri Nov 02, 2007 1:53 am 
Offline
Master Pilot
User avatar

Joined: Sat Sep 13, 2003 3:10 am
Posts: 177
I was wondering the same things...

As I read the last few pages, my mouth hung open in utter shock (I'm not one to read the last page first, so I had NO IDEA what was about to happen.)

[spoiler] I'm not so concerned about the Worm. What I am concerned about is Time itself. What happens to the Arch now that the Timewarden has been snatched away????? :shock: :shock: [/spoiler]

_________________
Love's Divine


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Fri Nov 02, 2007 2:11 am 
Offline
Lady Scryer
User avatar

Joined: Sun Nov 17, 2002 5:11 pm
Posts: 9653
Location: Michigan, USA

_________________
Our lives are the songs that sing the universe into existence.~David Zindell

Image Image Image




Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Fri Nov 02, 2007 7:02 pm 
Offline
Master Pilot
User avatar

Joined: Mon Jun 27, 2005 5:34 am
Posts: 1559
Location: Winnipeg, Canada
[spoiler]

That's an interesting point, Furls. How can Covenant be there (the Arch of Time) and be here (made corporeal by Linden) at the same time? Something's got to give, eh? We now know that Roger was just feeding Linden b.s. about how he was folding time. Ok, on second thought, I guess he and the croyel really were doing that. But does his explanation about existing in two places at the same time still apply to the real Thomas Covenant? Questions, questions...


[/spoiler]


Top
 Profile  
 
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 10 posts ] 

All times are UTC


Who is online

Users browsing this forum: Google [Bot] and 2 guests


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum

cron
Powered by phpBB © 2000, 2002, 2005, 2007 phpBB Group