Ahira's Hangar

I just rented this movie from the library the other day, and it really impressed me. The main idea of the movie is about lucid dreaming (a subject in itself which has never been much of interest of mine, though I never really made the connection between it and shamanism, a big interest of mine), but there were several conversations, more like interviews, that reminded me of a great number of philosophical conversations I've had with others. Kind of woke me up from the monotone I've let my day to day become. I highly recommend it. The animation is a little jarring (animation drawn over film) and the conversations can get a little long-winded, but it's worth it. If anybody sees it or has seen it, let me know what you think. ________________
I wanna feel the metamorphosis and cleansing I've endured within my shadow. Change is coming. Now is my time. Listen to my muscle memory. Contemplate what I've been clinging to. -Tool, "Forty-Six & Two"<i></i>

What's the name of the movie? Oh, I get it! Waking Life! duh It took me a minute.

I'm really interested in shamanism also. My favorite book on the topic is Shamanic Voices, by Joan Halifax. In part 1, she gives a great, thorough description of shamanism. Part 2 is stories told by shamans from cultures around the world. Just an incredible book!! Fist and Faith<i>Edited by: Highdrake at: 3/14/03 8:54:15 pm
</i>

I believe I read that book, or at least skimmed through it, but unfortunately don't have it in my collection. Currently I have Shamanism: Archaic Techniques of Ecstacy, a very dry but insanely thorough text by Mircea Eliade and the Castaneda books. ________________
I wanna feel the metamorphosis and cleansing I've endured within my shadow. Change is coming. Now is my time. Listen to my muscle memory. Contemplate what I've been clinging to. -Tool, "Forty-Six & Two"<i></i>

I had a Castenda topic here 4 a little while, then deleted it...I'm game if any1 wants 2 discuss... And now Danlo looked in that direction, too. He remembered that snowy owls mate in the darkest part of deep winter, and so along with this beautiful white bird perched in a tree a hundred feet away, he turned to face the sea as he watched and waited.

Ahira, Ahira, he called out silently to the sky. Ahira, Ahira<i></i>

I'd love to talk some Castaneda. Definately an acquired taste, though. You'd think he'd appeal more to the fantasy set, considering his books are at least 50% allegoric fantasy. Some of the metaphysics and get pretty involved, though, especially in the later books... whew. ________________
I wanna feel the metamorphosis and cleansing I've endured within my shadow. Change is coming. Now is my time. Listen to my muscle memory. Contemplate what I've been clinging to. -Tool, "Forty-Six & Two"<i></i>

I've only read most of the original book, The Teachings of Don Juan. It is definitely an interesting thing for me to look past the drugs and find the wisdom. But it's there.

Quote:"A man goes to knowledge as he goes to war, wide-awake, with fear, with respect, and with absolute assurance. Going to knowledge or going to war in any other manner is a mistake, and whoever makes it will live to regret his steps."

Quote:"No! I'm not angry at anybody! No human being can do anything important enough for that. You get angry at people when you feel that their acts are important. I don't feel that way any longer."

Quote:"Does this path have a heart? All paths are the same: they lead nowhere. They are paths going through the bush, or into the bush. In my own life I could say I have traversed long, long paths, but I am not anywhere. My benefactor's question has meaning now. Does this path have a heart? If it does, the path is good; if it doesn't, it is of no use. Both paths lead nowhere; but one has a heart, the other doesn't. One makes for a joyful journey, as long as you follow it, you are one with it. The other will make you curse your life. One makes you strong; the other weakens you."

And the section where he discusses the four natural enemies one faces on the road to knowledge: Fear, Clarity, Power, and Old age. Fist and Faith<i></i>

I think in some ways the drugs are part of the wisdom (in one of the books, it seemed like it was by far the largest part). For instance, when he talks about the different "spirits", he poses the question of does the user choose the drug or the drug the user (and other than mescalito, I still don't know half the substances he was talking about, like Don Juan's "little smoke," though I'm beginning to think he was refering to Salvia Divinorum). Are laid back people drawn to marijuana, or does this spirit impart some of its characteristics to its servants? Also, some spirits are more controlling and demanding than others, usually in proportion to the "power" it gives to its adherents.

The part about the four enemies was excellent, though. I was po'd when he succumbed so early.

It's been a while since I read them. I'll have to skim them over again to remember some of the better ideas. ________________
I wanna feel the metamorphosis and cleansing I've endured within my shadow. Change is coming. Now is my time. Listen to my muscle memory. Contemplate what I've been clinging to. -Tool, "Forty-Six & Two"<i></i>

Juan would, of course, disagree, but, in my view of things, the drugs are part of the wisdom only in that they reveal different aspects of the user. The true wisdom is in the contemplation of the visions/hallucinations. What fears were revealed? What strengths, desires, loves? IMO, these things can be revealed in better ways, but Juan didn't just become a mindless stoner. He thought he was studying the spirits of the world, I think the spirits were different aspects of himself.

BTW, another comic book mention. There was briefly a series called Shaman's Tears. It stressed the idea that you don't choose the power, the power chooses you. A bit too much comic book super-powers, not enough stuff based on shaman lore, but it was a lot of fun. Fist and Faith<i></i>

Didn't the "little smoke" refer 2 the Datura Root? I think they may have said that it could kill if it wasn't prepared just right in a number of other factors... And now Danlo looked in that direction, too. He remembered that snowy owls mate in the darkest part of deep winter, and so along with this beautiful white bird perched in a tree a hundred feet away, he turned to face the sea as he watched and waited.

Ahira, Ahira, he called out silently to the sky. Ahira, Ahira<i>Edited by: danlo60 at: 3/17/03 9:50:09 pm
</i>

Fist, that's about what I meant to say. Not that, "Whoah, check out these trippy effects from these various plants," but, "Whoah, check out these various insights." The nature of users (somewhat of abuse) and the hidden nature of self.

That sounds correct, Danlo, but I've never seen Datura Root mentioned elsewhere. Of course, I've never heard of Salvia Divinorum before I was doing some searches on lucid dreaming (ended up at www.sagewisdom.org ), so I don't imagine I have too much non-recreational drug knowledge.

Heh, isn't peyote found naturally in NM? ________________
I wanna feel the metamorphosis and cleansing I've endured within my shadow. Change is coming. Now is my time. Listen to my muscle memory. Contemplate what I've been clinging to. -Tool, "Forty-Six & Two"<i></i>

Quote:Jimson Weed Seeds, Datura sp.
One good reason to smoke an herb as a preferred method of ingestion is regulation of dosage. You can smoke an herb that is very strong and regulate the dosage safety. The difference between medicine and poison is dosage. Many plants are too strong to take internally safely. If you take a tea, it may take half an hour or more before you can tell how strong of a dosage you took. At that point it is too late to take less. When you smoke an herb the effects or side effects become apparent quickly. If the herb doesn't agree with you, you can stop before overdosing.
Jimson weed is definitely a strong hallucinogen, poison, medicine any way you look at it. The dosage is all important. I do not recommend internal use of Datura without the guidance of a shaman. The use of Datura for a high by pimply adolescents looking for some fireworks is deplorable. Too many of them end up as newspaper reports. I personally know of people who have landed in the hospital for extended stays because of this plant.

Used in the proper dosages, Datura can be a very effective treatment for a variety of problems. Smoke the crushed seeds only. The seeds are the mildest part of the plant. Just a few puffs will anesthetize your throat and lungs. This could be very helpful with some lung problems. You will not feel psychological effects from this small a dosage. I have used this method of taking this herb and will guarantee that you will not get high from two puffs. This plant does not agree with some people. If you feel light headed or nauseous, then stop smoking it. No harm will be done. -Howie Broundstien @ DaturaHeaven website

Peyote exists in NM and as always stories abound, usually by bikers in seedy bars, of the secret canyon-nook fields in mid east 2 south east NM but it's either rare-ish or carefully hidden. Alot of it grows in west 2 SW Texas and is used 4 religious purposes only by a fairly vague defintion of "The Ghost Shirt" society. Numerous lesiglation has come along in the past 15 years of so that outlawed that religion, reinstated it--heck I don't I what the status is now. I do know that it's at least illegal now 2 take over the Texas borders. Mescalero Apaches seem 2 b able 2 get thier hands on it when they want, despite the border rule...

"Flesh of the Gods" psycillosyben (sp) is smoked @ certian point of the books, brought, I believe, by Don Genaro (what an awesome character...) and that drug has a very interesting connection 2 an ancient Mayan religious city that stood just below the SE Yucatan in southern Mexico very close 2 Belize. It starts w/a "P", but I can never remember it's name (will have 2 look up). Any way it was called the Pink City where Mayan warriors, and others, went through their mystical rituals in order 2 understand and go "byond death" (and consort w/their vaious gods) b4 battle.

There is a direct connection btween the Pink City and the Hopis of NE Arizona, thousands of miles away... And now Danlo looked in that direction, too. He remembered that snowy owls mate in the darkest part of deep winter, and so along with this beautiful white bird perched in a tree a hundred feet away, he turned to face the sea as he watched and waited.

Ahira, Ahira, he called out silently to the sky. Ahira, Ahira<i>Edited by: danlo60 at: 3/18/03 7:32:26 am
</i>

Is "flesh of the gods" psilocybe distinct from the common psilocybe ('shrooms)? I've heard some 'shrooms vary in potency by region and such, but don't know much about it (respectable literature on the subject is non-surprisingly scant). ________________
I wanna feel the metamorphosis and cleansing I've endured within my shadow. Change is coming. Now is my time. Listen to my muscle memory. Contemplate what I've been clinging to. -Tool, "Forty-Six & Two"<i></i>

The Pink City (Travelouge )

Palenque: The original builders of these ruined structures carved histories in stone which scholars have only recently acquired the ability to decipher. One of the events carved in stone is the account of an elaborate ceremony in A.D. 683 when King Pacal was buried in a secret pyramidal tomb. This tomb remained undiscovered until 1952.

Flesh of the Gods is xtremly powerful! If, processed the right way can give 1 an amazing out-of-body xperience, there r rumors that the Mayans may have, originally, learned of it's uses from the Inca. The warriors at Palengue talked about completely leaving their bodies and fighting demons or contacting their personal god in a completely dif dimesion..

And now Danlo looked in that direction, too. He remembered that snowy owls mate in the darkest part of deep winter, and so along with this beautiful white bird perched in a tree a hundred feet away, he turned to face the sea as he watched and waited.

Ahira, Ahira, he called out silently to the sky. Ahira, Ahira<i></i>

I hate to think of how many books Castenada wrote, because I don't have time to read them! But I don't remember Don Genaro. He wasn't in the first book, was he?

Not to change the subject away from drugs , but has anybody heard of Fools Crow? Nephew of Black Elk, and a Lakota Holy Man himself. Fools Crow: Wisdom and Power is a fantastic book! (I'm just starting Fools Crow, but I'm also just starting Martin and Zindell, so who knows how long it will take to read it.) I only read it several months ago, and he instantly became one of my favorite people ever. He offers many examples of the kind of thing that I mentioned in another post - things that, though religious to him, I can apply to myself. Here's a few things I particularly like:
Quote:"They show me how to see things from different points of view, to see how this way or that way might work in each situation. As I turn this information over in my mind, I become more creative, more fertile. But I do not become too involved with little details - just the big picture."Quote:"In their personal relationship with the Higher Powers, people out there will use the concentration tools a little differently than I do. The first time they might try to copy me exactly, and maybe the next time. But then they will reshape what they do until it is entirely their own in communion with the Higher Powers. When the desired results are reached, they should not ask how it happened or whether it was done like I would do it. They should just accept it and be glad."Quote:        "People who don’t know Wakan-Tanka and the Helpers can not lure good things from them. Evil knows this, and takes advantage of every opportunity they give it to tempt them. As we can see, people are easily captured."
        "Why don’t the Higher Powers interfere with this so that people won’t be hurt?"
        "We have every opportunity in life to have things different. Except for what happens in nature, we bring our own curses down on our own heads."Quote:…good is as threatening to us and our relationship with Wakan-Tanka as evil is. "When life is too good," Fools Crow said, "we think too highly of ourselves and our blessings. Then we decide we are the wisest and the favored ones, and we don’t think we need Wakan-Tanka and the Helpers any more."Quote:"Anyone who is willing to lead the life I have led can do the things I do. I am out here on this remote reservation and am only here on earth for just a little while. Why would Wakan-Tanka limit these things to me? People all over the world have the same needs, and those who want to serve Him can be as big to Him as they want to be. The pity is that they doubt this and limit themselves."Quote:"It is always the same where the concentration tools are concerned. Making them, purifying them with smoke, and setting them up and using them, all takes time, and during this time you sink deeper and deeper into communion with Wakan-Tanka and the Helpers. This gives Them the time they need to work in and through you, and they can accomplish more. It is the same thing as when we make our ceremonial costumes and paint our bodies. All of this takes time, but it is a way of going more intensely into the experience. We feel it more and we think about it more. By the time we do our ceremony, our daily life and any distractions have been put aside, and we are ready to receive the power and set it in motion. Naturally, the end result is far greater than it would be if we did not do these things."This is very similar to a passage in Zen in the Art of Archery, which is kinda long, so I won't include it.
Fist and Faith<i></i>

I read Zen and the Art of Archery in the bookstore (Hastings, I think) in one day. I always meant to go back and buy it. I wouldn't mind seeing the post (assuming it's not like 20 pages). ________________
I wanna feel the metamorphosis and cleansing I've endured within my shadow. Change is coming. Now is my time. Listen to my muscle memory. Contemplate what I've been clinging to. -Tool, "Forty-Six & Two"<i></i>